kenneth copeland

[Godgrl Gomer]

wow these guys sound crazy! a lot to do about nothing! what was the bit about baptisits and methodists? whats the problem? Jesus doesn't save via denomination....

[Gandalf]

Originally Posted by jrmitch

For Godgrl and others unfamiliar w/Copelands background and theology here's a link from Apologetics Index that gives some helpful info:
http://www.apologeticsindex.com/c53.html

This quote pretty well sums it up:

Copeland's errors are largely due to his negative stance on reasoning, his poor handling of the Bible, his aversion toward theology, and his bias against tradition.

Originally Posted by Tulip 5points

i immediately left. i didnt want to talk to anybody. i didnt want to rip kenneth. i just wanted to get out without getting sucked in to a bunch of conversations. because i knew it would be ugly.

That was probably wise. No good would've come of arguing with people who explicitly refuse to use reason to form their beliefs.

[Pouye]

Originally Posted by Tulip 5points

you must wave a flag, speak in tongues, and dance to chris tomlin music. you must be happy when you do it.

at least that is what i deduced from the service. no reverence at all. very emotionally charged and the pastors seem to use that "emotion" to control the people. why do i say control?

because when the guy was giving this formula for speaking in tongues, he warned againt letting your mind get in the way. that just doesnt add up. i wont receive a gift because i have knowledge of doctrine? my mind hinders me from receiving blessings? sounds like crap to me

I was in a "Word of Faith" denomination for serveral years. I learned some good things, actually (nobody gets everything wrong), but I fully agree with you, and I know what you are talking about. I sat through many a similar meeting.

Actually, I still believe in the gifts of the Holy Spirit, but as the Bible teaches, not as taught by charismatic preachers who use large doses of emotionalism and sensationalism to mesmerize the throngs.

Rock

[bholdj]

Originally Posted by Tulip 5points

and that baptists and methodists essentially wouldnt be in heaven. i guess baptists and methodists dont meet this guy's standards in p and w.

Yea, i bet hes jealous! Methodists sure like to eat instead of do that tongues stuff

[middletree]

Originally Posted by Pouye

Actually, I still believe in the gifts of the Holy Spirit, but as the Bible teaches, not as taught by charismatic preachers who

I think people here have varying definitions of the word 'charismatic'. I believe that believers still have the gifts of the Holy Spirit, including the miraculous ones. Individuals have different gifts, all for the purpose of working together for God's work. The gift of teaching of hospitality is just as supernatural as healing or tongues.

If someone has the gift of healing, it will usually manifest itself in someone getting healthy due as answer to prayer offered up by someone with that gift, not with all of the hype we see on TBN.

If someone has the gift of tongues, there are very strict directives on how it is to take place. Most believers won't have this gift. Most won't have the gift of teaching, or administration, or any one single gift you can name.

By some people's definition, that would make me a charismatic. However, this thread and others use that name followed by descriptions of people who don't act or believe anything like I do.

I just hate to see everyone lumped together like that.

[Psalm25Gomer]

Originally Posted by Tulip 5points

beating the crap out of him would be my honor

I know someone who said that same thing about meeting Benny Hinn.

[Howlin' Wolf]

Originally Posted by middletree

I think people here have varying definitions of the word 'charismatic'. I believe that believers still have the gifts of the Holy Spirit, including the miraculous ones. Individuals have different gifts, all for the purpose of working together for God's work. The gift of teaching of hospitality is just as supernatural as healing or tongues.

If someone has the gift of healing, it will usually manifest itself in someone getting healthy due as answer to prayer offered up by someone with that gift, not with all of the hype we see on TBN.

If someone has the gift of tongues, there are very strict directives on how it is to take place. Most believers won't have this gift. Most won't have the gift of teaching, or administration, or any one single gift you can name.

By some people's definition, that would make me a charismatic. However, this thread and others use that name followed by descriptions of people who don't act or believe anything like I do.

I just hate to see everyone lumped together like that.

i agree with all of this

ironically, after i left, i called my old college roommate who is AoG, to tell him about everything

[Howlin' Wolf]

Originally Posted by Pouye

I was in a "Word of Faith" denomination for serveral years. I learned some good things, actually (nobody gets everything wrong), but I fully agree with you, and I know what you are talking about. I sat through many a similar meeting.

Actually, I still believe in the gifts of the Holy Spirit, but as the Bible teaches, not as taught by charismatic preachers who use large doses of emotionalism and sensationalism to mesmerize the throngs.

Rock

one thing i noticed, is that in praising God, they attributed EVERYTHING to God. God's total sovereignty over everything, including God being the one who decides what clothes we are going to wear.(the guy that said this was wearing a pink shirt and i could see his wifebeater underneath). now i am all for the sovereignty of God, as you all know. but even i dont attribute things like "what to wear" as a choice ordained by God. my question is how can they say all of that and then deny God's sovereignty over salvation? am i really to believe that God decides what i am going to eat everyday and what i am going to wear, but that sovereign election is bogus?

seriously, this guy's theology is a disaster

[Psalm25Gomer]

I heard rumors that Kenneth Copeland was also a Mason...someone saw the comic series he has..which features his character wearing a Mason's symbol.......so I emailed his ministry and asked....

Of course the response I got was: "Thank you for bringing this to our attention, dear Sister in Christ,...Brother Copeland is in NO way associated with the Masons...."

Hmmm......




I'm not bashing anyone who proclaims to be doing what God wants them to do....I have no right to be judging anyone...so I'm not.....however.....

The Lord did say to judge a person by their fruits.

[Tribal]

Originally Posted by Tulip 5points

i just wanted to get out without getting sucked in to a bunch of conversations.

Where is T-5p & what have you done with him !!!!!

[shelleybeansMAN]

Originally Posted by Tulip 5points

beating the crap out of him would be my honor

boy,that's real christian love there,huh?you say that because you dont agree with the man?

[ObiShawn]

Originally Posted by shelleybeansMAN

boy,that's real christian love there,huh?you say that because you dont agree with the man?

It isn't because he (we) disagree with him, it is because of the false doctrine that Kenneth spreads. Violence isn't the answer, of course. The original post (which I posted) that referred to "beating the crap out of Kenneth" was actually a bit of sarcasm, not an actual suggestion.

Wanting to punch a guy in the mouth and actually doing it are two different things. The question is "how legalistic do you want to get?" You can't say that you don't have urges and temptations that you don't act on. It's self-control that keeps us from doing such things.

[meak]

it seems that this message board has a problem with every preacher out there. i have never read a thread about a pastor that wasn't a complete flaming of their credibility and or the doctrine they teach. i honestly get sick of it. i highly doubt he said baptist or methodist won't go to heaven. apparently you don't believe in speaking in tongues, which is probably one of the reasons you despise his teachings. i've never heard any dirt on him but it's funny because i can come here and hear dirt on probably any preacher that doesn't preach nothing but "Jesus loves the little children, all the children of the world." just because you don't agree with some things a man preaches doesn't not make them a false whatever. all i care to know about you is Christ and him crucified. that's what paul said. so instead of talking about beating the crap out of a minister why not keep your own mouth shut and pray for the man if you feel that strongly about it. i am a little aggravated about this topic and i don't feel the need to be apologetic. i think this bashing is wrong...it is not constructive and is nothing but division.

[bholdj]

Originally Posted by meak

i think this bashing is wrong...it is not constructive and is nothing but division.

So, you believe meak, that if you, or any of us, see something we believe to be wrong, just leave it alone, right?

I mean, who cares if Mark Mcqwire, former slugger for the cardnials, has been medically proven to take steriods, i mean gosh its his choice, why should we bother ?

I agree, theres a time and a place for not bashing a fellow man. But there's also a time for dancing when the music starts.

[ObiShawn]

Originally Posted by meak

all i care to know about you is Christ and him crucified.

So, if I were a pastor of a church and secretly a pedophile, you'd be ok with that? I'm not saying that Copeland is a pedophile, just making a point that there is more to a person than their "claim" to be a Christian. But you appearently don't care because you are quick to defend the man when you have said yourself that you havne't heard these negative things about him.

Originally Posted by meak

so instead of talking about beating the crap out of a minister why not keep your own mouth shut and pray for the man if you feel that strongly about it. i am a little aggravated about this topic and i don't feel the need to be apologetic. i think this bashing is wrong...it is not constructive and is nothing but division.

As I stated in my previous post, the original post that even brought up beating the crap out of Copeland was sarcasm, not an actual suggestion. The point being that fighting him would be as pointless and ineffective to pursuade him to see a different point of view than talking to him, which has been done countless times.

Now, if this is true that the members of the board have bashed every preacher that gets brought up, I don't know anything about that, but if it is true, I could understand your anger at the situation.