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View Full Version : School penalizes students for hugs, high-fives


RevZeek
06-19-2007, 05:45 PM
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19293872/?GT1=10056

A shining example of the old adage, "the road to hell is paved with good intentions."

Comments anyone?

VIENNA, Va. - A rule against physical contact at a Fairfax County middle school is so strict that students can be sent to the principal's office for hugging, holding hands or even high-fiving.

Unlike some schools in the Washington area, which ban fighting or inappropriate touching, Kilmer Middle School in Vienna bans all touching — and that has some parents lobbying for a change.

Hugging was Hal Beaulieu's crime when he sat next to his girlfriend at lunch a few months ago and put his arm around her shoulder. He was given a warning, but told that repeat missteps could lead to detention.

"I think hugging is a good thing," said Hal, a seventh-grader. "I put my arm around her. It was like for 15 seconds. I didn't think it would be a big deal."

But at a school of 1,100 students that was meant to accommodate 850, school officials think some touching can turn into a big deal. They've seen pokes lead to fights, gang signs in the form of handshakes or girls who are uncomfortable being hugged but embarrassed to say anything.

"You get into shades of gray," Kilmer Principal Deborah Hernandez said. "The kids say, 'If he can high-five, then I can do this.' "

Hernandez said the no-touching rule is meant to ensure that all students are comfortable and crowded hallways and lunchrooms stay safe. She said school officials are allowed to use their judgment in enforcing the rule. Typically, only repeat offenders are reprimanded.

'Making out goes too far'
But such a strict policy doesn't seem necessary to 13-year-old Hal and his parents, who have written a letter to the county school board asking for a review of the rule. Hugging is encouraged in their home, and their son has been taught to greet someone with a handshake.

Hal said he feels he knows what's appropriate and what's not.

Does the no-contact rule go too far?
Has ‘zero tolerance’ in schools overstepped?

"I think you should be able to shake hands, high-five and maybe a quick hug," he said. "Making out goes too far."

His parents said they agree that teenagers need to have clear limits but don't want their son to be taught that physical contact is bad.

"How do kids learn what's right and what's wrong?" Henri Beaulieu asked. "They are all smart kids, and they can draw lines. If they cross them, they can get in trouble. But I don't think it would happen too often."

kiwisongbird
06-19-2007, 07:01 PM
That wouldn't work here, Thai people walk round holding hands a lot... but only girls with girls and boys with boys!!

I think it's a bit weird to go this far - surely the kids have enough brains to be able to work out what is too far and what is not?????

America, land of the free?????? Must make you all wonder sometimes?

Tony Trout
06-19-2007, 07:47 PM
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/19293872/?GT1=10056

A shining example of the old adage, "the road to hell is paved with good intentions."

Comments anyone?



I only have four words for this:

That is just plain nuts!! :eek: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

scbyd23
06-19-2007, 08:58 PM
I only have four words for this:

That is just plain nuts!! :eek: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:


That's 5 ;)

Tony Trout
06-19-2007, 10:10 PM
That's 5 ;)


Smartypants.....*SMACK*



Seriously, I think that's just plain crazy!!

Jake
06-19-2007, 10:22 PM
Some stuff just never ceases to amaze me...and I don't mean Tony's lack of ability to count lol

Tony Trout
06-19-2007, 10:37 PM
Some stuff just never ceases to amaze me...and I don't mean Tony's lack of ability to count lol




I can count...:P :P

I just wanted to see Lori's reaction but it looks like she's not around right now....*snaps fingers*


*hee hee*

RevZeek
06-19-2007, 10:42 PM
I think it's a bit weird to go this far - surely the kids have enough brains to be able to work out what is too far and what is not?????

America, land of the free?????? Must make you all wonder sometimes?

I think Mama LJ said exactly what I feel.

kiwisongbird
06-20-2007, 04:34 AM
It's a gift I have ;)

Evanescence
06-20-2007, 04:53 PM
Another example of Govt control....

Ridiculous!!! And they wonder why kids are quitting schools and rebelling !!!

Parents need to DEMAND schools stop their unnecessary rules and control. Another reason to home school or send to private schools....

:mad: :mad: :mad:

kiwisongbird
06-20-2007, 08:13 PM
A local international school here forbids kids from hugging their friends - the girls also get into trouble if someone dobs them in for wearing 'inappropriate' clothing outside of school time!

Sam!
06-21-2007, 06:49 PM
I subbed in middle schools this spring. I am not as upset about this as the rest of you seem to be. Kids will continue to push boundaries and limits. If it has become a problem in school, then you set a very firm boundary. The only real "firm" limit you can put on physical contact is "none." Otherwise you are going to have teachers and adminstrator interpreting it differently and you won't solve anything. Additionally, "acceptable" contact can escalate into unacceptable contact very quickly, and when there are hundreds of students in a crowded hallway... well, I can see where this would make it very clear as to what needs to be dealt with. The administration is not asking anything of the students that is impossible. If they can't follow that simple instruction, then... It's been suggested that common sense should solve the problem. What the previous policy was something along the lines of "no inappropriate touching/nothing that make someone else uncomfortable/nothing violent/etc." Left it up to judgment. And it didn't work. So they are trying something else.

luvmyrottie
06-22-2007, 03:20 PM
I subbed in middle schools this spring. I am not as upset about this as the rest of you seem to be. Kids will continue to push boundaries and limits. If it has become a problem in school, then you set a very firm boundary. The only real "firm" limit you can put on physical contact is "none." Otherwise you are going to have teachers and adminstrator interpreting it differently and you won't solve anything. Additionally, "acceptable" contact can escalate into unacceptable contact very quickly, and when there are hundreds of students in a crowded hallway... well, I can see where this would make it very clear as to what needs to be dealt with. The administration is not asking anything of the students that is impossible. If they can't follow that simple instruction, then... It's been suggested that common sense should solve the problem. What the previous policy was something along the lines of "no inappropriate touching/nothing that make someone else uncomfortable/nothing violent/etc." Left it up to judgment. And it didn't work. So they are trying something else.


well said! I also have been subbing in middle school and high school. There is no rule here about touching and there are fights in the hallways all the time. And it's not overcrowded, either. There are just too many rival gangs. And too many guys putting their hands on the girls and getting smacked for it, either by the girl or her friends or her boyfriend. The only way to stop it would be to institute a 'no touching' policy.

mat1583
06-22-2007, 03:54 PM
Another example of Govt control....

Ridiculous!!! And they wonder why kids are quitting schools and rebelling !!!

Parents need to DEMAND schools stop their unnecessary rules and control. Another reason to home school or send to private schools....

:mad: :mad: :mad:

I agree. In a private schooling system teachers and administration would work closely with parents (the tuition payers) to come to an agreement about the rules and regulations of the school. If a private school decides no hugging/kissing/touching, then so be it.

-washboard

Sam!
06-22-2007, 04:25 PM
But a public school, who had no control over who comes, who cannot possibly work collaborativelyw ith all parents, they shouldn't be able to enforce strict behavior policies?

kiwisongbird
06-23-2007, 04:15 AM
I have the solution to the problem, we could have schools with no kids! :) :) :) :D ;) ;)

freakysoccer
06-23-2007, 10:34 AM
I think it's kind of ridiculous. I mean he hugged his girlfriend. At my school there is a rule about inapproiate touching and it works, there are still fights from time to time but they are just dumb guys that have to settle things and are friends the next day. The touching thing applies to holding hands and things like kissing, but not hugging or shaking hands.

I have a good friend who is in college and i never get to see, sometimes he comes back to school to see teachers and friends, so when i get to see him i run up to him and give him a big hug (in the middle of my school), so should i get in trouble for hugging a long time friend.

I have also had a gut come up to me hit me on the bottom and say something nasty to me, to get him to stop i slapped him really hard and he did not bother me again,so that is a case with inapproiate settled without school officials.

freakysoccer
06-23-2007, 10:35 AM
I have the solution to the problem, we could have schools with no kids! :) :) :) :D ;) ;)


I agree !!!

TLJ
06-25-2007, 06:47 PM
That wouldn't work here, Thai people walk round holding hands a lot... but only girls with girls and boys with boys!!

I think it's a bit weird to go this far - surely the kids have enough brains to be able to work out what is too far and what is not?????

America, land of the free?????? Must make you all wonder sometimes?

From my recollections of Jr high, the answer to your question would be "no." Kids don't, and typically do go too far. However, I think that rules about appropriate contact are already in place & the whole "no contact" rule is extreme.
With gang handshakes, etc, it would be interesting to know what actually led to this extreme rule being put in place.