"Tunnel" Radio Mix!

[oncelost1224]

This is a complaint about modern radio. I just heard "Tunnel" on the radio for the first time today on my local Christian A/C radio station (we don't have a Christian rock radio station), and I found the radio remix to be quite disgusting. Now before I get bombarded with angry complaints, let me explain - I still liked the song and I'm sure it will do well on the charts, but could someone please explain to me why a great song like "Tunnel" needs to be dumbed down for Christian radio? If I'm not mistaken, all they did was take the drums and electric guitars down (and at some parts completely out) and (this was the worst part) changed the first part of the chorus after the solo from a minor electric to a major acoustic. Like I said, the song still sounded good and I would have thought it was awesome if it was the first time I'd heard it, but knowing what they took out just stole the life from the song. Is there really anyone who would only like the radio single but would be so offended by the amped electric guitar on the album version that they just couldn't listen? I mean come on, we're not talking heavy metal here! One of the things that makes Third Day the phenomenal band that they are is their ability to appeal to the popular radio crowd while still playing rock and roll. In my opinion this radio single totally undercuts that and tries to turn Third Day into MercyMe or Casting Crowns (not bad bands, just more pop radio-friendly). Giants like Third Day should be setting the standard, not following it!

(Deep breath)

Ok, clearly my feelings on this topic are strong and represent a greater irritation with the Christian music industry, not Third Day's radio singles. "Tunnel" is still an amazing song!

[Psycho Mom]

I saw it was #15 on the charts this last week.

[clemsontigers23]

I noticed that too. It sounded a lot different. Not necessarily bad, but I've had my complaints about Christian radio ever since I started listening to it. The fact that I'm 17 and it's aimed towards middle-aged soccer moms is a problem. I listen to The Fish in Atlanta, a radio station I'm sure the boys in the band are familiar with. I just don't like the whole "Safe for the Whole Family" thing.

[googledoll]

I'm not a big fan of the toned down radio mixes, either. I do know that our local AC station would never play TUNNEL in its orignial album version. (Which is why I don't listen to our local AC station.)
If it can be reworked and released to a broader audience, I'm all for it. Here's hoping 3D gets another Top 10 hit out of it.

[NurseBettyLu]

Phooey on AC radio mixes. I don't feel like I need to be dumbed-down to. *sigh* Well, at least they're getting airplay.

[googledoll]

I don't know that I would call it "dumbing down". It's not that heavier guitars and drums are more intellectual. ;) It's a softening of the sound, that is certain. Obviously, the mix is intended to appeal to the more mellow crowd.

It's done all the time. I remember the first time I heard Avril's COMPLICATED on the radio. Guitars? Gone! Not my thing, but if it get's someone else's attention, then it serves a purpose, right?

[Psycho Mom]

I agree with Traci, just a different way of playing it. It will appeal to some more and others less. The song is great and I think either will be just fine! I just hope it keeps climbing the charts.

[oncelost1224]

In spite of my strong objection to bringing Avril Lavigne into a Third Day discussion, you make a good point googledoll. "Dumbing down" was admittedly a bit biased on my part (not to mention historically inaccurate since I've never known electric guitars to be associated with intelligence), but I was trying to say that bands and artists shouldn't have to make remixes of every song they want to release to radio. It's all part of an evil corporate plot to reduce music to nothing more than a way to make money, and lots of it if you own the right record company, radio station, media conglomerate, etc. I'd love to think that when I have my own multi-platinum rock band, I'd sooner die than allow one of my songs to be remixed for radio, but the truth is I would probably just complain really loudly about it until I got my paycheck. Oh the absurdity of life! Lester Bangs' warning in Almost Famous (and probably real life too) is becoming more and more relevant..."Too bad you're too late. Rock and roll, it's over. You might have made it for the death rattle...."

[rossid]

So that was a new mix I heard this week? Man my ears are ignorant.

[macs#1fan]

I saw it was #15 on the charts this last week.
thats not right!!!! it should have been #1!!!!!!i love that song!!!!!!

[SirMax]

Well I heard it today and was thrilled. My radio station here seems to have one ONLY Third Day song and that's "It's Alright"....I swear that is the only Third Day song I ever hear them playing so I just about ran off the road in sheer jubilation that something else was being played!:D

[googledoll]

In spite of my strong objection to bringing Avril Lavigne into a Third Day discussion,


Ha! That made me laugh out loud! :D

You're points are are certainly valid. As fans, we all have our preferences and mine is heavy guitars and pounding drums.

I wish we had a station here that would play the album cut of TUNNEL. Our station here (which I only hear at work b/c its our hold music) thinks Third Day recorded 2 songs: Sing A Song and I Believe.

[Psycho Mom]

Well I heard it today and was thrilled. My radio station here seems to have one ONLY Third Day song and that's "It's Alright"....I swear that is the only Third Day song I ever hear them playing so I just about ran off the road in sheer jubilation that something else was being played!:D

I thought you lived in Raleigh, Not Augusta, GA!

[MrsC_Aussie]

tis a bit sad to hear of dumbed down versions, makes me more grateful for the Christian Radio here in Ballarat, they have different segments through out the week, and if you want to listen to new new stuff its Sat mornings, or 'Drivetime'fr om 5-7 on weekday nights, where they still play a mix, but definitely get quite a variety of artists including our beloved 3D boys then!

[SirMax]

I thought you lived in Raleigh, Not Augusta, GA!

See....it's the ONLY Third Day song ever.....;)

Well Traci at least you get 2 songs!!!

[SmileyFreak1981]

The Christian radio station who has been here in Abilene the longest barely plays Third Day at all, and when they do it's something off of one of the Offerings records or My Hope is You or Cry Out to Jesus.

Then we've had a corporate Christian station for a couple of years...the DJ's ain't local, and it's all light and fluffy and soccer mom approved...I don't really listen to it, honestly. I don't hear a lot of Third Day there, but when I do it's the softer songs.

Then, a couple of months ago, we got Air1. Praise the Lord! They play Third Day fairly often (among other great music) and the version of Tunnel that I've heard has been the CD version.

[oncelost1224]

Sweet, glad to hear that they're playing the real version on some stations! :D

[SmileyFreak1981]

Hey...you are in Dallas....tune to 89.7 Power FM, they have Tunnel in heavy rotation according to the playlist (http://www.897powerfm.com/playlist.html) on their website, and I can pretty much guarantee they ain't playing the softer version...I listen to them online at times, but I haven't in a while. Great station. :cool:

[oncelost1224]

Wow, thanks for the tip! Unfortunately my profile lied - I'm currently in my hometown of Mobile, AL. I'm heading back to Dallas in the summer, though, so I will definitely listen for it then. And you're right, 89.7 is usually pretty good and they would definitely not play the softer version!

[TaiAnderson]

The band is neverly over excited about the radio mixes. But, they really send Brad to the dark side, especially when they cut all the rockin' electric guitar parts. Fair enough, he really spends a lot of time and energy to make something slamming, and it often gets "tweaked" away.

I guess the hope is that they will attract more people to the album where the bigger artistic vision can be heard. The good songs can survive the subtle differences.

What's funny is when the song is mellower, they want to rock it up for the radio (Cry Out to Jesus AC Mix),, when it is already Rockin' (Tunnel), they like to soften it up. This could be one of the reasons, along with a ton of compression, that people often legitmitaley complain that everything on the radio sounds the same, whether it started out that way or not.

Anyway, just speaking as a fellow gomer here.

[Sharon]

The band is neverly over excited about the radio mixes. But, they really send Brad to the dark side, especially when they cut all the rockin' electric guitar parts. Fair enough, he really spends a lot of time and energy to make something slamming, and it often gets "tweaked" away.

I guess the hope is that they will attract more people to the album where the bigger artistic vision can be heard. The good songs can survive the subtle differences.

What's funny is when the song is mellower, they want to rock it up for the radio (Cry Out to Jesus AC Mix),, when it is already Rockin' (Tunnel), they like to soften it up. This could be one of the reasons, along with a ton of compression, that people often legitmitaley complain that everything on the radio sounds the same, whether it started out that way or not.

Anyway, just speaking as a fellow gomer here.

Yeah ..... that would kinda ..... (think Hoover vacuum). And I do agree that it mostly sounds the same. Thank goodness for Ipods!! :D

But .... as was stated earlier, if this gets you more crossover airplay then isn't it worth it?

[Raylon]

Just speaking from knowing both major radio stations in the metro Atlanta area. They both only target for women listeners. Both stations have survey the area and it's like 85% women listens to CCM.

Trust me, that's my dream. If I ever win or get enough money to open up a Christian rock station, I would drop my camera for good.

You really need to complain to the station manager in your area. Who knows, they may listen. Then again, that's why I have a mp3 player in my truck.

[3D NC fan]

Tai, thanks for the band perspective. Our CCM station plays a lot of Third Day, but the CD version of Tunnel is probably too rocking for their audience.

[oncelost1224]

Wow now I feel bad. I've never caught the band's attention with anything I've posted on the boards, but now I finally get it done when I'm whining! To Tai and the rest of Third Day, I'm still a Third Day maniac. I'm the biggest Third Day fan I know, my friends all worry about me turning into a stalker (think Jimmy Macelroy's stalker in Blades Of Glory...ok, not that bad, but you see where I'm going), etc. I just wanted to be clear that my initial post was a complaint about modern radio format and its attempts to make everything sound the same. I was NOT complaining about the song "Tunnel" or the band. Tai, if you're still around, how much input do y'all get in making radio edits? Does the band choose what's dropped or does a producer do that in the studio and send it to y'all for approval? Thanks for the response!

PS: Tell Brad not to get too dark on us - we all know how awesome his riffs are whether we get to hear them on the radio or not!

[wolfgang]

I've heard the song on XM radio and I'm fairly certain it was the album version.

[SirMax]

Just speaking from knowing both major radio stations in the metro Atlanta area. They both only target for women listeners. Both stations have survey the area and it's like 85% women listens to CCM.

Trust me, that's my dream. If I ever win or get enough money to open up a Christian rock station, I would drop my camera for good.

You really need to complain to the station manager in your area. Who knows, they may listen. Then again, that's why I have a mp3 player in my truck.
Well I would LOVE to meet the women that listen because this woman isn't at all pleased with CCM radio!

[rossid]

I'm not sure which version KLOVE played this morning. Could not find my copy of WYA to try and make a comparison.

[shuhree]

The band is neverly over excited about the radio mixes. But, they really send Brad to the dark side, especially when they cut all the rockin' electric guitar parts. Fair enough, he really spends a lot of time and energy to make something slamming, and it often gets "tweaked" away.

I guess the hope is that they will attract more people to the album where the bigger artistic vision can be heard. The good songs can survive the subtle differences.

What's funny is when the song is mellower, they want to rock it up for the radio (Cry Out to Jesus AC Mix),, when it is already Rockin' (Tunnel), they like to soften it up. This could be one of the reasons, along with a ton of compression, that people often legitmitaley complain that everything on the radio sounds the same, whether it started out that way or not.

Anyway, just speaking as a fellow gomer here.

I personally love the live-recorded songs (which is very strange because very few bands vocally sound better live) but you guys are so amazing live that I know I will always prefer those... That being said, radio mixes give me my 3D fix when new songs come out and I still love them... it makes me just that more excited about hearing you guys live....

~ Cajun Gomer

[clemsontigers23]

Just speaking from knowing both major radio stations in the metro Atlanta area. They both only target for women listeners. Both stations have survey the area and it's like 85% women listens to CCM.

Trust me, that's my dream. If I ever win or get enough money to open up a Christian rock station, I would drop my camera for good.

You really need to complain to the station manager in your area. Who knows, they may listen. Then again, that's why I have a mp3 player in my truck.

Yeah, The Fish REALLY gets on my nerves sometimes. Every once in awhile I'll hear a good song, but it's rare these days. The only other option is His Radio, and it's even worse than The Fish. No wonder people think Christian music is too sissy. That's all they play on the radio.

[Martyred]

Yeah, The Fish REALLY gets on my nerves sometimes. Every once in awhile I'll hear a good song, but it's rare these days. The only other option is His Radio, and it's even worse than The Fish. No wonder people think Christian music is too sissy. That's all they play on the radio.


I wanna start a radio station that plays all the good Christian music... From the lighter stuff like Third Day (which isn't all that light at all), to the real heavy stuff....

[clemsontigers23]

That would be great. There are radio stations like that out there, but not enough of them. Certainly not around here, I know that for sure. I would ask how Third Day feels about Christian radio today, but that would be like asking them to commit suicide haha. Shaun Groves spoke his mind and now Christian radio won't even touch his stuff. He had a lot of valid points, though.

It is nice to know that the band, at least Tai and Brad, don't like it either.

[Raylon]

"CREED" is another great example. I love Brad's intro solo in the beginning and radio cuts it out and go right into the song. Also notice that Third Day stop playing the intro as well, at their last 2 shows.

[clemsontigers23]

Yeah, I'll be honest, I don't even like the song besides the guitar solo at the beginning. The solo is amazing. Brad must be pretty ticked that their cutting out all of his solos haha.

[oncelost1224]

Raylon, actually that opening Pink Floyd-esque solo is Mark's. Brad plays the one in the middle of "Creed" (with heavy wah). I thought the same thing when I first heard that song but then saw on the Come Together DVD that I was mistaken. I really wish I could have seen that song live with the extended "Fever Dog" intro, but the three times I've seen them play it, it's been cut. I think on the Wherever You Are tour last spring ('06), they opened with the long version for several shows. What a great way to start a concert! My brother still brags to me that he got to see it!

[Psycho Mom]

Song moved up two spots this week to #13 on the charts!!! YEAH!!!

[oncelost1224]

What charts are you looking at? I'd love to check 'em out.

[Psycho Mom]

I got it from a gospel music association email, but I think it comes from billboard.com

[SmileyFreak1981]

On complaining to station managers...

I don't know how much impact that would have with commercial radio stations (ie. ones that are owned by ClearChannel, etc.) but listener supported ones would probably listen to what you have to say.

Some people like what mainstream ccm radio plays, but I think there are a lot who don't...Christian Music Today actually did a four part series on Christian radio, which, if you haven't read it, would be good to check out (http://www.christianitytoday.com/music/news/2007/whatsupwithradio.html) if your interested in how they choose songs, etc. (link is to part one, other links are on the right hand side of the article linked.)

[clemsontigers23]

I actually e-mailed the guy at 104.7 The Fish, Kevin, who does the morning show and actually runs the station. I asked them to play more Kutless, as I rarely ever heard Kutless on the radio and at the time I was really into their "Hearts of the Innocent" album. He didn't really explain how everything worked, but he was basically saying that he really didn't have a say in the songs they played. I think it's a Salem Communications thing, which is the huge corporation that owns the Fish stations. He was very kind in his responses. I also asked in a polite way why they never even mentioned God in their morning show, and he said they were trying to provide a comfortable environment for the listener and that the music took care of the ministry. I didn't really understand that one but he was really nice about it. I don't think the stations owned by large corportations are going to be very receptive.

I've read the Christian Music Today series, and I don't like how they choose the music and what kind of target audience they're shooting for (middle-aged women, mainly soccer moms, who spend a lot of time in the minivan). It's great that it's Safe for the Whole Family, but they don't do much to build your faith. I've sorta given up on them and went back to CDs.

[3D NC fan]

Our station here has a listener advisory panel. However, you only get to select from a few new songs each time they send out a survey. They are listener supported and play a lot of Third Day.

[NurseBettyLu]

Guess it's my fault for not fitting my demographic (female, mid to late 40's), but I like loud and edgy. A good squalling guitar riff blows my socks off. I've gotten to where I listen to very little radio. It just drives me crazy.

[Raylon]

Guess it's my fault for not fitting my demographic (female, mid to late 40's), but I like loud and edgy. A good squalling guitar riff blows my socks off. I've gotten to where I listen to very little radio. It just drives me crazy.


Girl !!!

http://i24.photobucket.com/albums/c5/EdenBee/you-rock.gif

[NurseBettyLu]

Now if I could only move like that without doing myself a hurt...

[Martyred]

lol... rotfl

[g-man]

I'm just happy to be able to turn on the radio and hear that there is Light at the end of the tunnel . I really really really need to hear that and believe that right now.

On a side note I heard Tunnel on KLOVE today and it sounded the same as the CD. Solo and all. Are my ears bad or are they playing the Album version. Can I still call it that? :cool:

[NurseBettyLu]

I officially give you permission to call them albums.

[NurseBettyLu]

And, yes, thank goodness the message is still there. That's the most important thing, after all.

[Godgrl Gomer]

at least your Christian radio stations play Tunnel....:rolleyes:

I cannot think of WHY Tunnel should be softened! Gosh...it wouldnt be Tunnel if it were changed...man...I'd be going to the dark side to. I am with you there Brad!:mad:

[TheBus36(Retired)]

I just about ran off the road in sheer jubilation that something else was being played!:D

Hmmm, I wonder would would happen if I got your station to play GIVE!!!!! :D

(** Seatbelt **)

The one that really get's me is our local station basically just cuts the middle out of King of Glory. What's wrong with playing the entire song?

[NurseBettyLu]

Who knows. Like I said, I just don't listen to the radio. Need to see if I can get my mp3 fixed so I don't have to carry my CD's everywhere I go.

[dknight73]

I didn't notice such a difference in the radio mix of "Tunnel"...I thought it was really good to hear another cut from the album being played for the public to hear. I really like this song (especially when played in concert with the special effects)...but I was a little disappointed that "Rise Up" or "Eagles" wasn't released ahead of this one. These seem to be a little more "Pop" friendly and have such great messages. I tried to request "Rise Up", but was told that it couldn't be played unless it's released. Oh well...just glad a new song is being played on the radio. If it were up to me, I would release all of the tracks off of this album...there are such great messages in all of the songs.

Let us Gomers get our voices out there and request "Tunnel" like crazy so that we can all watch it rise to number 1!!

[rossid]

I[FONT="Comic Sans MS"] didn't notice such a difference in the radio mix of "Tunnel"...I thought it was really good to hear another cut from the album being played for the public to hear. Ditto! :D

[GraceAbounds]

I noticed the same thing too, and it did dumb down the guitars some, but actually, I found the guitar solo in the bridge stood out a lot more.

It reminded me a lot of Steven Curtis Chapman's "The Change," Where they took out the gritty electric guitar and dissonant orchestration in the bridge and at the end, but it didn't really detract from the message of the song.

Therefore, my response to the new radio mix of Tunnel is bittersweet - it sounded fresh without all the gritty guitars, but if 3D wanted to soften the tone, I would have loved to have heard them put up an acoustic version, much like Jars of Clay's "Work." They did an acoustic radio version of that song and it was amazing, in my opinion.

Speaking of which, I would love to hear quite a few songs with an acoustic version from 3D. "I Can Feel It" sounds amazing on acoustic guitars - I know it would sound great if 3D did it.

[clemsontigers23]

It reminded me a lot of Steven Curtis Chapman's "The Change,"

I think that was the point. Tunnel was too unique for Christian radio, so they had to make it sound like everything else.

[jumpingmaniac]

IMO, they are burining the song out. It is a truly GREAT song, but almost everytime i turn on the radio it is on. If they arent careful they'll burn it out.

[rossid]

I'm not getting burned out here. Just heard it this morning.

"You've got your disappointments and sorrows
I'm gonna try and give a little hope to you."

:D

[GraceAbounds]

This is the first thread I've seen with honest dissatisfaction with a Third Day song. If the radio edit were the original, you would've wondered why they added all the hard guitars. :)

[jcinme]

I haven't heard our Christian radio station play Tunnel, but I did hear them play Come On Back to Me the other day when I was in my car, and it definitely wasn't dummed down. It totally rocked!!

[clemsontigers23]

This is the first thread I've seen with honest dissatisfaction with a Third Day song. If the radio edit were the original, you would've wondered why they added all the hard guitars. :)

No one is dissatisfied with the song itself. They are dissatisfied with AC Christian radio, which is very understandable. Even some of the members of Third are a little annoyed with the mix. I think it was Tai that was talking about it.


The band is neverly over excited about the radio mixes. But, they really send Brad to the dark side, especially when they cut all the rockin' electric guitar parts. Fair enough, he really spends a lot of time and energy to make something slamming, and it often gets "tweaked" away.

I guess the hope is that they will attract more people to the album where the bigger artistic vision can be heard. The good songs can survive the subtle differences.

What's funny is when the song is mellower, they want to rock it up for the radio (Cry Out to Jesus AC Mix),, when it is already Rockin' (Tunnel), they like to soften it up. This could be one of the reasons, along with a ton of compression, that people often legitmitaley complain that everything on the radio sounds the same, whether it started out that way or not.

Anyway, just speaking as a fellow gomer here.

[GraceAbounds]

Nah, I understand, I read Tai's post here :). I could imagine that Brad is a little miffed about it - if someone took my music that I worked hard to sound different, then mixed it all up to sound the same, I'd be mad, too. I know *hopefully* everyone loves the song "Tunnel," but the differences in the two versions are at least subtle enough not to make me really think less of the radio mix.

It intrigues me though that there is a more rocky version of Cry Out to Jesus. Our local station plays it pretty much exactly as it sounds on the CD - I didn't really notice any difference. Anywhere I can take a listen to this AC Mix of CotJ? :D

[oncelost1224]

If the radio edit were the original, you would've wondered why they added all the hard guitars. :)

I can't stress enough how false this statement is.

[3D NC fan]

I heard the Tunnel radio mix on The Fish while driving back from GR show in Atlanta. While it's not the same as the CD version, it's still good for another 3D song to be on the radio.